shapechange vs true polymorph

It retains its alignment and personality. If the creature has the same proficiency as you and the bonus listed in its statistics is higher than yours, use the creatures bonus in place of yours. Shapechange states that you turn into a typical example of the creature withoutthe Spellcasting trait, but Crawford has confirmed on twitter that you would keep your ability to cast your own spells because that comes from your class features. The intent is that a druid using Wild Shape is disintegrated if You do not get the chance at a death saving throw, nor to stabilize in the disintegrate case. You can only speak if the creature can normally speak. If you concentrate on this spell for the full duration, the transformation lasts until it is dispelled. The only catch is that you can't regain HP this way - if you shapechange into a new form (not the initial casting) that has higher HP than what you're currently changed as, you keep the same HP. True ploymorph an ally into a ghost then true polymorph another ally into a gold shadow dragon. The creature can't be a construct or an undead, and you must have seen the sort of creature at least once. The "or dies" can be applied to all creatures that are not a PC; those creatures usually die when dropped to 0 HP. Unlike every other polymorph-type spell or ability, you maintain access to all your class features (including spellcasting). RPGBOT contributing author and podcast co-host Random Powell is back with another exciting article, this time hey wait a minute, I can just write these myself. User without create permission can create a custom object from Managed package using Custom Rest API, Extracting arguments from a list of function calls. The advice offered below is based on the current State of the Character Optimization Meta as of when the article was last updated. You can however keep using True Polymorph to turn into various creatures with spell slots, and exhaust them all. What if, again, its a golem that you ordered to protect something and it sat for an hour doing absolutely nothing? It might just be easier to balance the skill levels between the two spells and make them identical, its not canon but we are not unknown for compromising in the name of balance. RPGBOT uses the color coding scheme which has become common among Pathfinder build handbooks, which is simple to understand and easy to read at a glance. Could a subterranean river or aquifer generate enough continuous momentum to power a waterwheel for the purpose of producing electricity? Just because a form you take is capable of casting spells does not mean you can inherently cast any spells that arent part of that stat block. True Polymorph, Dragon Change Shape, and True Sight interaction. Your scouting and combat forms may change as new options become available, but since your disable form should generally be CR 0 it probably wont change much. When you drop to 0 hit points, you either die outright or fall unconscious, as explained in the following sections. Role-playing Games Stack Exchange is a question and answer site for gamemasters and players of tabletop, paper-and-pencil role-playing games. Improving the copy in the close modal and post notices - 2023 edition, New blog post from our CEO Prashanth: Community is the future of AI. A failed save always sucks, but I'd be glad to have this up as a damage sponge if nothing else in that case (because you'd lose the concentration after taking the damage). by Nylo Sun Jul 08, 2012 1:47 pm, Post Speaking of gold, this is an even better way of breaking economies than Wish, which is impressive. You cant use any legendary actions or lair actions of the new form. This lets you almost fully turn into something while still being an enormously powerful spellcaster from time to time if needed. The wording is different than the wording for the spell in the. Shapechange only turns you into another creature. Has the Melford Hall manuscript poem "Whoso terms love a fire" been attributed to any poetDonne, Roe, or other? That's what incalculable power is for. In theory you should last at least 3 or 4 rounds as the creature in question (if it has Legendary Resistance) and in that time, you should be able to mess some stuff up. Thank you for your comment and welcome to RPG StackExchange. Equipment that merges has no effect in that state. Sort of sucks. Thats just basically a movie screen that a Scrying is playing on. Has the cause of a rocket failure ever been mis-identified, such that another launch failed due to the same problem? Shapechange gives more cheesy options, like a Pit Fiend bladesinging, with shield spell mastery. If you would like to change your settings or withdraw consent at any time, the link to do so is in our privacy policy accessible from our home page.. D&D 5E Problems with Polymorph, True Polymorph, and Shapechange - EN World You know, animal stuff. Why favor Disintegrate? What if you cast Polymorph at 6th (I don't know rules for ties in spell level) or higher? The description of the polymorph spell states that "A shapechanger automatically succeeds on this saving throw". There is nothing in the rules that says you cannot revert to your original form if you are no longer a "creature." If so, to what effect? Can you choose an age category? Can True Polymorph create creatures with the Spellcasting feature? @JeremyECrawford Do Wild Shaped druids or polymorphed creatures count as "shapechangers" for Moonbeam, or only things w/ (shapechanger) tag? If I choose skeleton, what kind of skeleton am I? For the duration, the creature has truesight, notices secret doors hidden by magic, and can see into the Ethereal Plane, all out to a range of 120 feet. I see your general point on spell text. As we all know, Hex is a really useful spell. Can a Wizard polymorph low-level PCs into over-powered beasts? You transform into an average example of that creature, one without any class levels or the Spellcasting trait. As long as the excess damage doesnt reduce the creatures normal form to 0 hit points, it isnt knocked unconscious., Nothing particularly noteworthy here. Mighty villains and special nonplayer characters are common exceptions; the GM might have them fall unconscious and follow the same rules as player characters. Portions of the materials used are property of Wizards of the Coast. True Polymorph and Polymorph both say target assumes the hit points of its new form, and when it reverts to its normal form, the creature returns to the number of hit points it had before it transformed. Apparently, RAI is in opposition to my other answer. So I should ask my DM. As written, I can polymorph a sufficiently large rock into a Drider, Plane Shift it to the Demonweb Pits, and then have it run up and try to attack Lolth while I sit safely at home. I though it was referring to Huge or larger enemies and objects. Choose one creature or nonmagical object that you can see within range. He can be an epic dragon, but will be able to PPP back into his Clone if he ever dies. Keep in mind that the state of the meta periodically changes as new source materials are released, and the article will be updated accordingly as time allows. 1.0, How to break the game with Animal Messenger (starting at level 3), AMFES: Summer 2, Now with Digital Tokens Included, 2020 Holiday Ornament and Black Friday Sale, If this is your first visit, be sure to This spell combines very well with the War Caster feat as it gives an advantage on the save. I'd be more interested in being able to shape change into a Adult Bronze Dragon. or, if we were in the ocean. a leviathan good god this would be epic, As I am reading it - rules as written - at level 17, when you can gain access to this spell, you could Shapechange into"any" Adult Dragon (assuming you had seenthe type of dragon before). If you transform into a Marilith, you can still speak and have hands to make Somatic gestures for those types of spells. It reverts to its true form if it dies. When every problem is a nail, its nice to have a good hammer. This spell has no effect on a shapechanger or a creature with 0 hit points. The Sage Advice Compendium supports this answer from a RAW perspective: What happens if a druid using Wild Shape is reduced to 0 hit points by disintegrate? ); Just not at the hour a level suggested here. It uses this ability to turn into a CR 12 Archmage, which has the Spellcasting feature, allowing it to cast spells using as an 18th level spellcaster, using its intelligence score. If the null hypothesis is never really true, is there a point to using a statistical test without a priori power analysis? If the spell becomes permanent, you no longer control the creature. @JeremyECrawford What happens if a wild shaped druid is reduced to 0 by disintegrate? Be a Quori, use Mind Seed, turn into a Frost Worm and burrow into the ground. The creature can be restored to life only by means of a true resurrection or a wish spell. or b) The body polymorphs back into its original form, then it disintegrates. And that particular cat form, if it's the one I'm thinking - it stops working at level 43 because, according to the race file, it recieves massive stat boosts at that level, becoming essentially a dire form. If I can be a golem, they dont have species so what happens there? You recover your uses in the span of an in-game day. and have only 1 hit point left, you revert and take 9 damage. The tweet favors the "specific" of polymorph/Wild Shape/Shapechange/True Polymorph, rather than the specific of disintegrate, requiring the exhaustion of both HP pools before being turned to dust by that spell. If one rules that way, True Polymorph, Polymorph, Wildshape, and Shapechange become special defenses against the Disintegrate spell, even though these spells already provide the added benefit of an extra HP pool for the creature in that shape. True Polymorph Concentration Level 9th Casting Time 1 Action Range/Area 30 ft Components V, S, M * Duration Concentration 1 Hour School Transmutation Attack/Save WIS Save Damage/Effect Buff (.) Next paragraph: The targets gear melds into the new form. That's over a day of straight shapechange. Granted, if the carry over HP from disintegrate reaches your max HP total, the dead the PC will be. Keep in mind that the state of the meta periodically changes as new source materials are released, and the article will be updated accordingly as time allows. Wizards of the Coast LLC. What is Wario dropping at the end of Super Mario Land 2 and why? I think freeing shapechange from Polymorph's duration constraints and list of available creatures (elementals, magical beasts, etc. If you're concentrating on one spell, and you cast another concentration spell, when exactly does the first spell end? Site design / logo 2023 Stack Exchange Inc; user contributions licensed under CC BY-SA. Allies may need to use Animal Handling to direct the target (they are a best now, after all). I have the idea that the "or dies" was for all other cases than PC, and the 0 HP was 'for all cases PC and those rare special NPC's that get to use the 0 HP rule." If you turn a creature into an object, it transforms along with whatever it is wearing and carrying into that form, as long as the objects size is no larger than the creatures size. We and our partners use cookies to Store and/or access information on a device. Mearles has stated time and time again his responses is how *he* would rule it. Which do you guys think is better they're so similar and I can't find a good straight answer. Your equipment doesn't change shape or size to match the new form, and any equipment that the new form can't wear must either fall to the ground or merge into your new form. MIP Model with relaxed integer constraints takes longer to solve than normal model, why? When you revert to your normal form, you return to the number of hit The spell lasts for the duration, or until the target drops to 0 hit points or dies. shapechange vs true polymorph - CDL Technical & Motorcycle Driving School Apparently, RAI is in opposition to my other answer per a tweet from Mr Crawford (Credit to @Airatome for this tweet): Jeremy Crawford It also explicitly calls out that you dont get any class levels or a spellcasting trait, (meaning you cant use the Diviner stat block from Volos mentioned above) which, again, seems to imply that you can with True Polymorph since this spell bothers calling that you cant. The Polymorph spell is an extremely versatile and powerful tool. by Tarven Sat Jul 07, 2012 5:29 pm, Post Can an object created by True Polymorph be used as a consumable spell component? My bad on this one, I set the wizard testing polymorph to the wrong skill level. You assume the form of a different creature for the duration. You may also want to read the Shapechange and True Polymorph spell descriptions, but understand Polymorph is more important since it is more limited, and once you grasp Polymorph you should be able to apply that knowledge to other spells. A pile of dust is not a creature. Never noticed that, always looked at the spell and not the trait. Does casting Disintegrate on a polymorphed enemy still kill it after the 2018 errata? Lets say, at my table, you can use any stat block that isnt for a unique creature. Is there a difference between When you are reduced to 0 hit points and when you would be reduced to 0 hit points? :). You assume the form of a different creature for the duration. Does it use its culture? The best answers are voted up and rise to the top, Not the answer you're looking for? As a kill spell, this is incredible functionality, although we run into suddenly needing to know things like how many hitpoints a 5ft cube of rock has because, once again, reducing the block to 0 hitpoints will end the spell. Obviously the chain gets broken if they fail a Concentration saving throw, but they'd get the Adult Gold Dragon's Legendary Resistance to help them out, there - and it'd get reset every time they True Polymorph themselves, too. The targets game statistics, including mental ability scores, are replaced by the statistics of the chosen beast. This land shall come to the God who knows the answer to War. If you turn a creature into an object, it transforms along with whatever it is wearing and carrying into that form, as long as the objects size is no larger than the creatures size. Wild Shape also comes into the game much earlier than those spells. (Later printings state instead that "The spell has no effect on a shapechanger".) All of this detail diving violates KISS principle, which is why I tried to focus on the "spell effect" and its unusual " and your equipment too" detail as significant. I would personally try to fall between the two but closer to the lax end (because this is a 9th level spell and the game left the rails behind long ago at that point). If you concentrate on this spell for the full duration, the spell lasts until it is dispelled. form to 0 hit points, you arent knocked unconscious. Well, no. If you want to support your answer as written, suggest you refer to the sage advice compendium, page 14, since JCrawford covered both cases in that SA final draft. Being able to use a bonus action to transfer the effect to a new target makes it a great bonus damage dealer. You lose concentration on a spell if you cast another spell that requires concentration. Shapechange targets self, where true polymorph can target others. Shapechanging You assume the form of a different creature for the duration. Random Powell. Who knows. (RAW). A proper Wizard needs no friends. Given that the spell costs an action, you may not even get to take a single turn with your new form and accomplish nothing more than burning a level 9 spell slot. document.getElementById("ak_js_1").setAttribute("value",(new Date()).getTime()); DnD 5e New Practical Guide to True Polymorph and Shapechange, Practical Guide to True Polymorph and Shapechange DnD 5e. Creature into Creature. Well-treated is entirely culture dependent. Has anyone used this spell in a game? The targets game statistics, including mental ability scores, are replaced by the statistics of the new form. Yeahhh.. What are you talking about? Does Disintegrate reduce the a Polymorphed target to dust first or does the creature revert to its regular form first? Shapechange only turns you into another creature. Others won't. If I use magic to see a pit fiend in a dream (with the Dream spell), does that count? What is the meaning of 'permanent' in description of True Polymorph? The creature cant activate, use, wield, or otherwise benefit from any of its equipment. This one is a little disappointing because Shapechange is way more generous about what you can do with your gear if you cast it on yourself, but given that this is also supposed to function as Uber Baleful Polymorph I guess it makes sense that you wouldnt want to let the person youre turning into a standard turtle continue wearing their Robe of the Archmagi. You could see it as one of two things, though they both have very similar end results: a) The body simply disintegrates, and stays that way. During this spells duration, you can use your action to assume a different form following the same restrictions and rules for the original form, with one exception: if your new form has more hit points than your current one, your hit points remain at their current value. Can I use an 11 watt LED bulb in a lamp rated for 8.6 watts maximum? However, it does offer useful forms that your allies can ride. The transition phase still needs a creature to make that happen. Best creatures to turn into with true polymorph? : r/dndnext - Reddit Connect and share knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to search. You can't use any legendary actions or lair actions of the new form. Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site. Druids are woefully starved of their basic class features in FK. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. is there such a thing as "right to be heard"? Why does Acts not mention the deaths of Peter and Paul? All of that is part of the pile of dust. The targets game statistics, including mental ability scores, are replaced by the statistics of the new form. This allows you to do some interesting cheese where you cast a Contingency Dispel Magic and say When I think unmorph me of my own free will, cast Dispel Magic to target the True Polymorph running on me, then live for up to just shy of 10 days as an Ancient Brass Dragon, flip to human for a moment, and go back to being a dragon. Is there anything that prevents this from working? You cant use any special senses you have (for example, darkvision) unless your new form also has that sense. You also retain all of your skill and saving throw proficiencies, in addition to gaining those of the creature. @NautArch That's correct. The new form can be of any creature with a challenge rating equal to your level or lower. Crawford calls out that, RAI, a depiction of one (like a drawing) would not work, but then goes on to say that using a Crystal Ball on one would. If the intent was to include all things legendary I believe it would have been writen that way. Does a Clone spell work on a (True) Polymorphed creature? Adding EV Charger (100A) in secondary panel (100A) fed off main (200A). What does any kind you choose mean? You can't use any special senses you have (for example, darkvision) unless your new form also has that sense. A level 50 druid with 10 skill in shapechange obtains 2/3 of the duration as a level 50 wizard with 10 skill in polymorph. and perceive the original form of a Shapechanger or a creature that is transformed by magic. You cant use any legendary actions or lair actions of the new form. Unfortunately, thats unlikely to change unless WotC gets really into more dire whatevers since the Tyrannosaurus is generally considered the biggest, chompiest dinosaur. At least of the Chromatic and Metallic standards. by Gwain Sat Jul 07, 2012 6:22 pm, Post Hex and Polymorph/ShapeChange - Warlock - Class Forums - D&D Beyond That's the biggest advantage - True Polymorph can let you create a decently strong companion if you decide to turn an object into a creature. Immediate vagueness problems. The ability is usable a few times per day, but it is based. Before you read this guide, read the Polymorph spell description on the 5e SRD. If a player said they were going to start training to become a wizard again, I'd say "yep, you certainly try to gain wizard powers". We also wont cover Unearthed Arcana content because its not finalized, and we cant guarantee that it will be available to you in your games. Continue with Recommended Cookies. Lets take a look at each paragraph in turn here. Should be about cr 27 if I remember correctly or atleast ancient gold dragon cr. True Polymorph only lets you use the abilities of the thing you change into and you lose your race and class features while transformed. We and our partners use data for Personalised ads and content, ad and content measurement, audience insights and product development. ok, yep, so the definitions of Truesight and True Seeing are different. It can cripple enemies, turn the caster or an ally into a ferocious beast, or provide you with utility options which are difficult to replicate without relying on numerous other spells at once.

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